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Seth and Christian thought
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TOPIC: Seth and Christian thought

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #960

  • Paul
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Dear Lloyd,

I agree that we have no choice but to follow what seems to us to be true. The trick, though, is to be willing to revise what we think is true if we need to. This requires a great deal of courage, since it can be painful to give up what we thought was true, especially if we're in a group that supports us in our old ways of thinking. I haven't noticed too many people who would react like the great Ralph Waldo:

"Of course you will insist on modesty in the children, and respect to their teachers, but if the boy stops you in your speech, cries out that you are wrong and sets you right, hug him!" -Ralph Waldo Emerson, writer and philosopher (1803-1882).

As a teacher, I can tell you that my first reaction would be something else!

If I haven't mentioned this before, check out Emerson's 1836 "Divinity School Address" on the internet. He was never invited back to Harvard Divinity School, because he told them that Christ (and other great figures) was a model of what they could become, not a deity to be worshipped.

Needless to say: They were not happy with Emerson.

"What blessings I have to give you, I give you."

Paul

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #965

  • greybear
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Paul,

"I agree that we have no choice but to follow what seems to us to be true. The trick, though, is to be willing to revise what we think is true if we need to. This requires a great deal of courage, since it can be painful to give up what we thought was true, especially if we're in a group that supports us in our old ways of thinking. I haven't noticed too many people who would react like the great Ralph Waldo:"

My take is that I have to be willing to relentlessly question everything, regardless of the source. All the "Ghosts" say in effect to take what they say with a grain of salt - and well they should! One thing I respect about "The Law of One" channelling that I've read is that the "authors" make it plain that they are in a process of attempting to compensate for actions taken a few thousand years ago which did not produce advances in their objective. I think similar things could be said about Seth, Elias, etc. etc. - that they are carrying out a needed (and loving) teaching/learning process which will be capable of bringing about advancement in their eternal objectives, as well as ours. Again, if they had satisfied their own objectives, we would not know of them. And if their perceptions were indeed "Ultimate Truth", I also believe we would not know of them.
So in my opinion that goes for the rest of us - or more certainly, myself. If I had already attained knowledge of the fullness of truth, we would not be having this conversation - so "perception", the realm we all deal in, is NOT Ultimate Truth - but it is the best we have put together at the moment. But never think it is the final word!

I've left behind virtually all prior social and religious community in the last 15 years or so. For me, it DOES seem lonely at times, but I'm of a loner nature anyway, except when I have a strong objective to accomplish. After all, "bears" are basically loners (except during mating season!). However, it can be more of a problem for those with different makeup.

What I DO see is that my family and extended family are moving in the same direction, and they are "expanding" to take up the space in MYSELF that emptied out when I took a more aggressive posture in terms of my own growth and understanding.

What happens is that we create "suction" that "pulls" those closest in vibration to us. As we "empty" ourselves of unfruitful things (and some relationships become unfruitful), we create a "vacuum" that draws in others who are ready to expand in our direction. Sometimes even the memory of prior relationships fades or somehow changes to adapt to us. I think this is really what is meant by "creating our own reality" - we willfully move ourselves into adjacent tracks of available probabilities that may contain some of the "priors", but these may seem different, somehow.

This process of movement into different probability "tracks" may be more difficult, of course, for socially-motivated persons who may tend to absorb their perceptions more from their social circles than from their inner leading. I see a lot of "youngsters", especially "teens", who are completely lost if they are separated from their "friends" and do not have a cell phone. I have grandchildren who fit this mode.

"Of course you will insist on modesty in the children, and respect to their teachers, but if the boy stops you in your speech, cries out that you are wrong and sets you right, hug him!" -Ralph Waldo Emerson, writer and philosopher (1803-1882)."

One thing I absorbed from reading ACIM is the reality of the teach/learn principle. If one would TEACH, he first has to prepare - else he has nothing to teach. Preparation is the process of continually growing by opening up to the witness within and asking the questions until one is prepared for the answer. When one is prepared to "teach", the subject will appear. Until then, no growth can occur.

The subject may indeed be a "child" in the street. I remember Seth talking about children. We think it's our imperative to "teach" them and "set them straight". What we are actually doing is enculturating them to point where they are as bound up as we are. He recommended something like moving them to a desert isle and allowing them to grow up unsullied, as I recall.

But the point is, we have more to learn from children than they do from us. The "Jesus" of the Bible even said that the "Kingdom of Heaven" was made up of little children. Maybe those that continually asked questions??

Lloyd
Last Edit: 2 years, 8 months ago by greybear. Reason: Formatting

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #973

  • Bill I.
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Paul: Another less philosophical connection is found in the idea of the "spiritual gifts." St. Paul's early communities experienced ecstatic phenomena, e.g., healings, prophecy, glossalalia (speaking in tongues), etc., which Sethies would recognize as psychic abilities stemming from using the Inner Senses. These were squelched fairly early by institutionalization, but never die. Fundamentalists, who are often difficult to take, nevertheless are often folks who can say they have experienced spiritual realities.

We have a very powerful and deeply influential myth -- Christianity -- deeply infused in millions of minds after 2,000 years or so, a myth so "psychically" powerful that some tuned in to it even before it arose.

The myth turns a man into a god and the son of a god, his mother into a divine receptacle. Its roots lie in older myth -- Judaism -- itself built on even older myth (Mesopotamian) while its symbolism resembles that of other myths of the ancient world.

Many of us were brought up within the tradition of some version of the myth and likely this was true for our parents, their parents, and so on back to some distant day when barbarian ancestors were converted, forcibly or not.

Further, any number of "past" versions of ourselves also were brought up within a similar Christian tradition.

As such, it resonates within us, deeply, and simply discarding it and dealing with the nature of reality directly, sans myth, is often easier said than done.

The same can be said of Seth, Jane, and Rob.

Seth, for example, speaks of a life as a pope and another life as a seller of donkey bells in the time and place in which the myth arose, a time not very similar to the mythical picture taught us from an early age, a very complex time and place seething with all kinds of energy and conflict set at the waning edge of what we consider "the Ancient World."

Per various sessions, Rob lives as both Roman and Jewish teacher close to that time, while little is said publicly of Jane's relevant lives but these definitely exist, too, as those who have communicated with the deceased Jane discovered long ago. A version of Jane was very close to those from whose activities the myth arose while another version attained sainthood within the dimensions of the massive hierarchical structure that arose to contain and defend the myth. It's no wonder then, that this was a very charged topic for the trio of Seth, Jane, and Rob, highlighted by Jane's severe Catholic upbringing.

Personally, I would dispense -- as much as possible -- with the myth and all of its teachings and not imagine a "Christ consciousness" (it's not possible to imagine this without invoking the myth, owing to the very word "Christ," while Seth's use of the "Christ Entity" doesn't help, either).

Even so, I have long been intrigued with the particular entity involved, no matter what you choose to call it, even once organizing attempts to channel it -- several times over the years -- during that brief period when dozens of on-line Seth readers experimented with channelling.

This proved very difficult, however, for a number of reasons. Everyone involved had difficulty distancing themselves from "awe" associated with this entity, owing to the holy moly aspects of the myth, even after choosing a less charged name -- "UncleCharlie" -- by which to designate this entity. The associations with the myth are, again, deeply embedded in our minds, and not just our conscious minds.

(Of course there are other myths, other entities and even massive concatenations of entities, some very likely closely connected with this particular entity and, as it turns out, not entirely mythical. I speak in particular of Nataraja -- "Lord of Dance" -- one of the many names pertaining to the Hindu myth of Shiva, but that lies outside of the topic at hand.)

Some would pooh pooh attempts to dismiss Christianity as mythical, suggesting that "good works" or love as presented in the NT transcend the hierarchical nonsense of the church and its offshoots and that these are valid, regardless of all else.

This may be so, but certainly any quality that is truly transcendent requires no sacred text, no connection whatsoever with any myth.

Back to the entity in question.

Have you ever wondered how your own entity relates to it?

Entities, per Seth (and I've been calling them "meta-selves" lately) exist outside of time and space. If, as Seth asserts, all "inner selves" are in continuous telepathic contact, then surely entities can communicate effortlessly with each other.

Thus is found another way to approach the overall topic -- simply inquire of your own entity.

Meanwhile, I continue to be fascinated by the tale told by Seth -- really a prediction, unique in the Seth material -- regarding the incarnation of Saul of Tarsus in our time. (This is found in Chapter 21. The Meaning of Religion, in Seth Speaks.)

Per this, "By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis. He will undermine religious organizations -- not unite them. His message will be that of the individual in relation to All That Is. He will clearly state methods by which each individual can attain a state of intimate contact with his own entity; the entity to some extent being man's mediator with All That Is."

"By that time" refers to a specific year, 2075, but after probing this with others in meditation, trance, and dreams it appears that this new aspect of the very same "Christ Entity" is presently alive.

I now read Seth's words as suggesting that the methods this new version of Saul will promote will have their full effect by 2075. So far as I know, he has not even formalized these yet.

Whatever these methods are, they are certainly intriguing. Can we "tune in" to them now, in 2009, and thus obtain "intimate contact" with our own entity now, today?

(After all, few of us will be alive in 2075. Why wait for their distribution, particularly if we may end up dying first?)

With this in mind, I continue to attempt to fathom the methods, both in thought and "experiment" (these do have something in common with Seth's exercises, after all, although it's already plain that they have some elements not found in those exercises, no matter how powerful and effective some of them are) my progress having accelerated in the last year or so.

I urge anyone reading this who is similarly inclined to share any relevant experience.

Did you ever do a particular Seth exercise -- say, for example, The Preliminary Probable Self exercise, or something equally strong, and experience a major alteration in consciousness?

Have you ever been interested in learning to slip into trance, inspired by Jane's channeling of Seth? If so, have you ever asked for or received information relating to attaining "intimate contact" with your entity or might you have achieved this, simply by your attempts to channel or write in trance?

Have you ever experienced what some call a "crown chakra expansion?" (This feels like an invisible 3-foot sphere has suddenly erupted from your head and may be accompanied by strong and recordable conscious instances of telepathy and/or pre-cognition and/or extremely vivid dreams of a like nature. Certainly here we get into those areas of "spiritual gifts" briefly mentioned by Paul (the initiator of this discussion, not the other, sainted Paul, sainted by the administrators of the structure built to house the Christian myth).

I've experienced this several times, the most powerful instance happening after I met three on-line Seth readers in person for the first time, and at the exact moment one of them began to speak for my own entity as she and her daughter operated their antique wooden ouija board.

I believe that the methods of the new edition of Saul of Tarsus at least touch on this kind of experience; that is, they combine techniques somewhat like some of Seth's exercises with other techniques that "raise the energy" found in our physical bodies but rarely -- if ever -- exercised, at least within western traditions.

Wouldn't it be fun to know what these methods are and become very practiced at using them?

Bill I.
Last Edit: 2 years, 8 months ago by Bill I..

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #998

  • greybear
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Bill,

Your description of a "crown chakra expansion" sounds very much like the episode described in the Bible where "Paul" was overcome by a vision of "Jesus" on the road to Damascus.

I can relate to this, having had perhaps the most intense episode of a feeling of love and acceptance that I have experienced ever in a dream/vision. A presence which was undeniably female "spoke to me" and assured me of "her" unfailing love and "real" intimacy.

Immediately on awakening, I began to type out a description of the episode. As I did, the description expanded and began to include other things.

Since that time, I have been "experimenting" with what I think you would describe as "light trance" autowriting. I posted some of these on NWV.

I have never intentionally used any form of exercises described by any of the "ghosts"; however I have intentionally sought "spiritual gifts" as described in the esoteric "Christian" tradition and have experienced many of these, including "tongues", "Interpretation of Tongues", "Prophecy", and what I would call "Word of Knowledge" and "Discerning of Spirits".

I have also been in meetings where some of these "gifts" were very much in evidence.

And of course, these things seem very congruent with the extra-sensory or spiritual senses that we talk about all the time.

Leading me to postulate that there are very active pathways to spiritual growth within any of "mythological" beliefs - even "Atheism".

Lloyd

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #1005

  • greybear
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Bill,

"I believe that the methods of the new edition of Saul of Tarsus at least touch on this kind of experience; that is, they combine techniques somewhat like some of Seth's exercises with other techniques that "raise the energy" found in our physical bodies but rarely -- if ever -- exercised, at least within western traditions."

Since we're talking about "raising the energy", I thought this link to one of Kryon's teachings about quantum DNA activation might be pertinent.

spiritlibrary.com/kryon/channelings/beginning-activation-of-dna

I don't recall anything such being mentioned by Seth, but I could be mistaken.

Could there be a link between this type of information and the Seth passages talking about Paul's re-entry into this reality? Perhaps this episode is of the form of a metaphor. I seem to recall from critiques about the Pauline epistles that Paul actually succeeded in transferring the heirarchical structure of the original? Jewish based religious thought rather than following the teachings of the "Jesus", which was the individual relationship of each to "their Father" rather than through an intermediary.

Lloyd

Re:Seth and Christian thought 2 years, 8 months ago #1006

  • Paul
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I'm wondering if we should start a new forum on Seth exercises? There is some wonderful stuff here.
Paul
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